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	<title>Comments on: On the RMIT Prayer Room Issue</title>
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		<title>By: Mohamed Elrafihi</title>
		<link>http://austrolabe.com/2008/05/18/on-the-rmit-prayer-room-issue/comment-page-2/#comment-165408</link>
		<dc:creator>Mohamed Elrafihi</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 18 Dec 2008 13:45:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://austrolabe.com/2008/05/18/on-the-rmit-prayer-room-issue/#comment-165408</guid>
		<description>Salam Allykum

Please help RMITIS save the Muslim Prayer Rooms by filling out the following Online Peititon http://www.petitiononline.com/RMITIS20/ 

We will be sending this to RMIT, and other Groups to help us pressure the Uni.

May Allah reward you all ameen</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Salam Allykum</p>
<p>Please help RMITIS save the Muslim Prayer Rooms by filling out the following Online Peititon <a href="http://www.petitiononline.com/RMITIS20/">http://www.petitiononline.com/RMITIS20/</a> </p>
<p>We will be sending this to RMIT, and other Groups to help us pressure the Uni.</p>
<p>May Allah reward you all ameen</p>
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		<title>By: Abdul Rahman</title>
		<link>http://austrolabe.com/2008/05/18/on-the-rmit-prayer-room-issue/comment-page-2/#comment-90662</link>
		<dc:creator>Abdul Rahman</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 26 May 2008 09:23:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://austrolabe.com/2008/05/18/on-the-rmit-prayer-room-issue/#comment-90662</guid>
		<description>Westmead, The RHW/POW/Sydney kids complex, Bankstown.

Why is it reasonable not to provide services at a state run facility simply because it is a secular institution? This reflects a poor understanding of the historical meaning of secular, which is not anti-religion at all. Is it because the services aren&#039;t used by everyone? Should the canteens then be shut simply because I don&#039;t eat out and always bring a cut lunch? What about wheel chair access ramps, I don&#039;t need them and neither do most of the population. 

From another perspective, would it be more convenient for the population of the university at large if several hundred Muslims prayed on the lawns two to three times a day or furtively looked around for empty rooms? How would this impact on those made uncomfortable by public displays of religion, or who just want to sit down and relax yet feel constrained by the loons bowing and prostrating?

What then is the basis of this &quot;more reasonable&quot; option?
Secularisation, user pays?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Westmead, The RHW/POW/Sydney kids complex, Bankstown.</p>
<p>Why is it reasonable not to provide services at a state run facility simply because it is a secular institution? This reflects a poor understanding of the historical meaning of secular, which is not anti-religion at all. Is it because the services aren&#8217;t used by everyone? Should the canteens then be shut simply because I don&#8217;t eat out and always bring a cut lunch? What about wheel chair access ramps, I don&#8217;t need them and neither do most of the population. </p>
<p>From another perspective, would it be more convenient for the population of the university at large if several hundred Muslims prayed on the lawns two to three times a day or furtively looked around for empty rooms? How would this impact on those made uncomfortable by public displays of religion, or who just want to sit down and relax yet feel constrained by the loons bowing and prostrating?</p>
<p>What then is the basis of this &#8220;more reasonable&#8221; option?<br />
Secularisation, user pays?</p>
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		<title>By: antish</title>
		<link>http://austrolabe.com/2008/05/18/on-the-rmit-prayer-room-issue/comment-page-2/#comment-90549</link>
		<dc:creator>antish</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 26 May 2008 02:11:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://austrolabe.com/2008/05/18/on-the-rmit-prayer-room-issue/#comment-90549</guid>
		<description>I think it&#039;s more reasonable not to provide any in a state-run institution. And as a matter of interest, what are the names of the Sydney hospitals you mention?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think it&#8217;s more reasonable not to provide any in a state-run institution. And as a matter of interest, what are the names of the Sydney hospitals you mention?</p>
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		<title>By: Abdul Rahman</title>
		<link>http://austrolabe.com/2008/05/18/on-the-rmit-prayer-room-issue/comment-page-2/#comment-90315</link>
		<dc:creator>Abdul Rahman</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 25 May 2008 09:55:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://austrolabe.com/2008/05/18/on-the-rmit-prayer-room-issue/#comment-90315</guid>
		<description>100% sure, I made explicit reference to purely state run public hospitals. I have spoken to people involved in the process and can think of two tertiary [ie: really big] and one secondary hospital in Sydney alone with this set up, the others I visit I have not checked.

The point is, if it is acceptable to maintain seperate facilities for one faith community, why not another who use these facilities at a high rate, both as a percentage of believers and in the regularity of use? It is not the same as providing a dedicated space for the reformed church of satan or even more seriously Hindus, Buddhists and Sikhs. 

We are the only faith community with such a regular and high volume use of these spaces, it is not unreasonable to make available a suitable place, whether we pay for it or not.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>100% sure, I made explicit reference to purely state run public hospitals. I have spoken to people involved in the process and can think of two tertiary [ie: really big] and one secondary hospital in Sydney alone with this set up, the others I visit I have not checked.</p>
<p>The point is, if it is acceptable to maintain seperate facilities for one faith community, why not another who use these facilities at a high rate, both as a percentage of believers and in the regularity of use? It is not the same as providing a dedicated space for the reformed church of satan or even more seriously Hindus, Buddhists and Sikhs. </p>
<p>We are the only faith community with such a regular and high volume use of these spaces, it is not unreasonable to make available a suitable place, whether we pay for it or not.</p>
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		<title>By: antish</title>
		<link>http://austrolabe.com/2008/05/18/on-the-rmit-prayer-room-issue/comment-page-2/#comment-90312</link>
		<dc:creator>antish</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 25 May 2008 09:38:34 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://austrolabe.com/2008/05/18/on-the-rmit-prayer-room-issue/#comment-90312</guid>
		<description>Are you sure? Eg, one of Melbourne&#039;s largest public, state-funded hospitals is St Vincent&#039;s. It&#039;s owned by the Catholic church so I wouldn&#039;t be surprised if &quot;priests&quot; had a say in the running of the chapel.

But anyway, what does this have to do with RMIT?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Are you sure? Eg, one of Melbourne&#8217;s largest public, state-funded hospitals is St Vincent&#8217;s. It&#8217;s owned by the Catholic church so I wouldn&#8217;t be surprised if &#8220;priests&#8221; had a say in the running of the chapel.</p>
<p>But anyway, what does this have to do with RMIT?</p>
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		<title>By: Abdul Rahman</title>
		<link>http://austrolabe.com/2008/05/18/on-the-rmit-prayer-room-issue/comment-page-2/#comment-90272</link>
		<dc:creator>Abdul Rahman</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 25 May 2008 06:48:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://austrolabe.com/2008/05/18/on-the-rmit-prayer-room-issue/#comment-90272</guid>
		<description>I am talking about secular public hospitals, both are publicly funded state run institutions, so I believe that the comparison is valid. Take a look at how many of them have a chapel as well as a multi-faith prayer room, I talk from experience and have seen many like this all over NSW havinga wife who works in the industry.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I am talking about secular public hospitals, both are publicly funded state run institutions, so I believe that the comparison is valid. Take a look at how many of them have a chapel as well as a multi-faith prayer room, I talk from experience and have seen many like this all over NSW havinga wife who works in the industry.</p>
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		<title>By: antish</title>
		<link>http://austrolabe.com/2008/05/18/on-the-rmit-prayer-room-issue/comment-page-2/#comment-90253</link>
		<dc:creator>antish</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 25 May 2008 05:30:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://austrolabe.com/2008/05/18/on-the-rmit-prayer-room-issue/#comment-90253</guid>
		<description>What on earth does the practise in hospitals have to do with a secular uni? (And are you confusing the christian - usually Catholic -&quot;public&quot; hospitals with purely government-run public hospitals? I don&#039;t know, but I suspect that secular hospitals tend not to have exclusively christian chapels and those that do are changing to multifaith, in line with Oz law.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>What on earth does the practise in hospitals have to do with a secular uni? (And are you confusing the christian &#8211; usually Catholic -&#8221;public&#8221; hospitals with purely government-run public hospitals? I don&#8217;t know, but I suspect that secular hospitals tend not to have exclusively christian chapels and those that do are changing to multifaith, in line with Oz law.</p>
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		<title>By: Abdul Rahman</title>
		<link>http://austrolabe.com/2008/05/18/on-the-rmit-prayer-room-issue/comment-page-1/#comment-90250</link>
		<dc:creator>Abdul Rahman</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 25 May 2008 05:15:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://austrolabe.com/2008/05/18/on-the-rmit-prayer-room-issue/#comment-90250</guid>
		<description>Strider, of course we need to speak to kaffirs in their own language, but that doesn&#039;t change the fact that our starting point in all of that should be an Islamic frame of reference.

Shadower, I agree that these institutions should not be required to provide what ever services anyone happens to want/demand or feel entitled to. A place of prayer is OUR responsibility, which goes back to having a Muslim frame of reference, so that we keep our understanding on these issues in a proper perspective. 

However, if there are sufficient Muslims on campus it would be in the University&#039;s best interest to do so, or at least make a space available for us to rent, just like what happens in the real world outside of these places.

How can women&#039;s requirement to pray in private [unless there is no alternative of course] be accomplished with a multi-faith prayer room? Having an unsegregated prayer room only works at my campus because there are only a handful of Muslims there at present. It is not selfish to ASK [demanding is simply rude] for this since we tend to use these facilities at a much higher rate than anyone else. The fact is, in hospitals where pre-existing chapels exist, the priests generally want these kept as Christian spaces.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Strider, of course we need to speak to kaffirs in their own language, but that doesn&#8217;t change the fact that our starting point in all of that should be an Islamic frame of reference.</p>
<p>Shadower, I agree that these institutions should not be required to provide what ever services anyone happens to want/demand or feel entitled to. A place of prayer is OUR responsibility, which goes back to having a Muslim frame of reference, so that we keep our understanding on these issues in a proper perspective. </p>
<p>However, if there are sufficient Muslims on campus it would be in the University&#8217;s best interest to do so, or at least make a space available for us to rent, just like what happens in the real world outside of these places.</p>
<p>How can women&#8217;s requirement to pray in private [unless there is no alternative of course] be accomplished with a multi-faith prayer room? Having an unsegregated prayer room only works at my campus because there are only a handful of Muslims there at present. It is not selfish to ASK [demanding is simply rude] for this since we tend to use these facilities at a much higher rate than anyone else. The fact is, in hospitals where pre-existing chapels exist, the priests generally want these kept as Christian spaces.</p>
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		<title>By: Shadower</title>
		<link>http://austrolabe.com/2008/05/18/on-the-rmit-prayer-room-issue/comment-page-1/#comment-89891</link>
		<dc:creator>Shadower</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 24 May 2008 05:03:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://austrolabe.com/2008/05/18/on-the-rmit-prayer-room-issue/#comment-89891</guid>
		<description>Abdul Rahman how is that going to help in this situation where RMIT is obviously not looking at it from an Islamic perspective? Looking at it from RMIT&#039;s point of view does not mean you are neglecting the Islamic viewpoint at all, rather that is the whole point behind this isn&#039;t it? At the end of the day the Islamic community is a niche market, and there are other providers of this service that have targeted this market in a more direct manner. 

The argument that they have to provide one because the Muslim women want somewhere to take their hijjab off is a weak argument, they asked for a place to pray and as far as I know a female is meant to be wearing the hijjab when praying, so what exactly is the point behind this argument to being with? No institute should have to provide an Islamic prayer room rather than a multifaith room. And I find it quite selfish of the Islamic community to be demanding this.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Abdul Rahman how is that going to help in this situation where RMIT is obviously not looking at it from an Islamic perspective? Looking at it from RMIT&#8217;s point of view does not mean you are neglecting the Islamic viewpoint at all, rather that is the whole point behind this isn&#8217;t it? At the end of the day the Islamic community is a niche market, and there are other providers of this service that have targeted this market in a more direct manner. </p>
<p>The argument that they have to provide one because the Muslim women want somewhere to take their hijjab off is a weak argument, they asked for a place to pray and as far as I know a female is meant to be wearing the hijjab when praying, so what exactly is the point behind this argument to being with? No institute should have to provide an Islamic prayer room rather than a multifaith room. And I find it quite selfish of the Islamic community to be demanding this.</p>
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		<title>By: GMan</title>
		<link>http://austrolabe.com/2008/05/18/on-the-rmit-prayer-room-issue/comment-page-1/#comment-89840</link>
		<dc:creator>GMan</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 24 May 2008 01:09:52 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://austrolabe.com/2008/05/18/on-the-rmit-prayer-room-issue/#comment-89840</guid>
		<description>The false religions of unbelievers Antish? Surely you jest.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The false religions of unbelievers Antish? Surely you jest.</p>
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